TESTIMONY OF WANDA YVONNE HELMICK

The testimony of Wanda Yvonne Helmick was taken at 4 p.m., on July 24, 1964, in the office of the U.S. attorney, 301 Post Office Building, Bryan and Ervay Streets, Dallas, Tex, by Mr. Burt W. Griffin, assistant counsel of the President's Commission.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Let me introduce myself again. I am Burt Griffin, and I am a member of the general counsel's staff of the President's Commission on the Assassination of President Kennedy.
It is our practice to have a few preliminaries here in which I explain to you what the Commission is all about, and what we are going to do. Then we will administer the oath and I will talk to you.
This President's Commission, as you probably know, was set up in November 1963, as a result of an Executive order of President Johnson and the joint resolution of Congress, and under these two official acts, we have been directed to investigate and to evaluate and report back to President Johnson on all the facts that relate to the assassination of President Kennedy and the death of Lee Oswald.
We have asked you to come here today because I understand you have some information that might pertain to Jack Ruby.
Now, under the rules and regulations of the Commission, I have been designated to take your testimony, and I might tell you t.hat the rules do provide that before you are asked to testify, you shall receive 3 days' notice in writing in advance before you come here.
I will ask you right now if you received a letter from us and when you did receive it.
Mrs. HELMICK. I received it yesterday.

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Mr. GRIFFIN. Then we haven't complied. Well, let me ask you if you are willing to go ahead and give us your testimony without having had the 3 days' written notice?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Thank you. Do you have any questions that you want to ask me before I ask you questions?
Mrs. HELMICK. No.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Would you raise your right hand and I will administer the oath to you.
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to give, will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
Mrs. HELMICK. I do.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Would you give us your name, please?
Mrs. HELMICK. Wanda Yvonne Helmick, or Wands Sweat Helmick.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where do you live now?
Mrs. HELMICK. 902 Bagley, Apartment 3.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where is that located in Dallas?
Mrs. HELMICK. In Arcadia Park in Dallas.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Is it Mrs. or Miss?
Mrs. HELMICK. Mrs.
Mr. GRIFFIN. When were you born, Mrs. Helmick?
Mrs. HELMICK. March 16, 1945.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Were you working for a man named Ralph Paul?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Back in November of 1963?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. When did you begin to work for Mr. Paul?
Mrs. HELMICK. I believe it was in November that I started to work for him. I don't remember the exact day.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How long did you work for him altogether?
Mrs. HELMICK. I was employed with him for 3 weeks.
Mr. GRIFFIN. When did you leave his employment?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What was your job?
Mrs. HELMICK. Carhop.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What hours did you work?
Mrs. HELMICK. I worked from 10 till 6, I think, or from 10 to 5.
Mr. GRIFFIN. 10 in the morning till 5 at night?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was this every day of the week?
Mrs. HELMICK. I had one day off. I don't remember which one it was.
Mr. GRIFFIN. I mean, did you always work those hours or did you ever work in the evening?
Mrs. HELMICK. I always worked those hours.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, you have talked to the FBI and have indicated that you overheard a telephone conversation that you believed took place between Jack Ruby and Ralph Paul?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. When was it that you heard that telephone conversation?
Mrs. HELMICK. It was the night before Oswald was shot.
Mr. GRIFFIN. The night before?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What time of day or night would that have been?
Mrs. HELMICK. Well, I believe it was around 8 or 9 o'clock. I am not for sure what time it was. My husband, he wasn't supposed to pick me up. Another girl was supposed to pick up and take me over. to her house so he would pick me up, but she didn't show up, and he came after me about 9 o'clock, I guess it was. Rather late at night I know that much. And this conversation took place after dark I don't know what time it was.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Were you working at that time?
Mrs. HELMICK. No; I was off of work. I had been off work about 3 or 4 hours.

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Mr. GRIFFIN. Where were you sitting at the time you heard this telephone conversation?
Mrs. HELMICK. In the front booth.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was this at the Bull Pen Drive-In?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. I want to ask you. to take a pencil here and a piece of paper and draw us a diagram of the inside of that Bull Pen Drive-In and show us on the diagram where you were seated and where the telephone was and so forth.
Mrs. HELMICK (drawing). This is where the booth was.
Mr. GRIFFIN. First of all, what have you drawn on there?
Mrs. HELMICK. This is where the telephone is.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where is the room? Would you draw the outline of the whole room first? Where are the walls of the room?
Mrs. HELMICK. This is the walls and then there is a little something that blocks between two rooms.
Mr. GRIFFIN. A partition of some sort?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes; a partition. And the booths are sitting next to it like this.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Is there a door to this room?
Mrs. HELMICK. No. There is a door coming into the whole thing from the front.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where is the door? Do you want to mark the door in there?
Mrs. HELMICK. This is the door. This opens into, and it opens onto the place where you pay as you go out.
Mr. GRIFFIN. The counter? Cashier? Where is the cashier?
Mrs. HELMICK. The cashier stands in behind this.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you want to write cashier in there?
Mrs. HELMICK. (Writes).
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now up in the upper left-hand corner of this diagram you have drawn a rectangle and you have written the words telephone and cashier. It is rectangular, some sort of enclosed area?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes; it is.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How do you get back into that enclosed area?
Mrs. HELMICK. There is a little open door like thing. It doesn't have a door in front of it. It is just an opening that you can walk behind the counter where all the trays sit for the carhops and everything.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where is that located? Can you mark it on the diagram?
Mrs. HELMICK. (Marks).
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, is the telephone that you have marked on there, which is behind the enclosed area, is that a public telephone, or a pay telephone?
Mrs. HELMICK. It is a pay telephone.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Are there any other telephones in there?
Mrs. HELMICK. No; there is not any other telephones there. I suppose that this booth is about anywhere from 3 to 6 feet away from the telephone.
Mr. GRIFFIN. You were seated in the booth?
Mrs. HELMICK. I was seated sitting in the first seat.
Mr. GRIFFIN. You want to mark yourself there? Put an "X" there where you were seated.
Mrs. HELMICK. Right here.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was anybody sitting there with you?
Mrs. HELMICK. There was people sitting there. Rose and a man I can't remember who was sitting beside me, and I believe Toyo.
Mr. GRIFFIN. First of all, what is Rose's last name?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did she work at the drive-in?
Mrs. HELMICK. She has been working there for about 7 years before I came.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Is she still working there to your knowledge?
Mrs. HELMICK. The last time I was there, which was about 6 months ago, she was still there.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you know where she lives?
Mrs. HELMICK. No.

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Mr. GRIFFIN. And there was somebody that you called Toyo?
Mrs. HELMICK. She was a Japanese woman.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Is she still working there?
Mrs. HELMICK. To my knowledge, she is.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was that her first name or her last name?
Mrs. HELMICK. That was her first name.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you know what her last name was?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't have no idea. It was an American name. I know where she lives.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where does she live?
Mrs. HELMICK. I believe it is 19th Street. Let's see, it's behind Taylor Super Market in Grand Prairie.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Grand Prairie?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was the cashier present at that time?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Who was the cashier?
Mrs. HELMICK. She was Rose.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, what happened? Will you tell us what happened?
Mrs. HELMICK. Well, we were sitting there gossiping about something, I don't remember what, but we was teasing or aggravating Johnnie well, Paul you call him.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was Ralph Paul sitting there at the booth with you?
Mrs. HELMICK. No, he was behind the counter, and Rose got up and went back there to do something, and she started talking to him, and the telephone rang, and she said, "It is for you. It is Jack."
So he took the phone and he had been talking quite a while, and he said something. He either said, "Are you crazy? A gun?" or something like that, or he said something about a gun.
Then he said, "Are you crazy?" But he did say something about a gun, and he asked him if he was crazy.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How long did he talk on this telephone call?
Mrs. HELMICK. He Just talked for about 5 minutes, I guess. It wasn't very long.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you hear anything else that was said in the telephone conversation?
Mrs. HELMICK. He said something about either he had a date with Tammi or Jack had a date with Tammi, and Jack wanted to talk to Ralph, and that is all I know.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, after you heard that conversation, did you talk with any of the other employees about that?
Mrs. HELMICK. No.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you know if any of the other people who were seated in that booth also heard that conversation?
Mrs. HELMICK. They were sitting close enough to hear it and there wasn't anything else being said at the time, because after Rose got up and went over to talk to Johnny, we didn't talk very much, and it was real quiet after she left. Nobody was saying anything.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What did Ralph do after receiving that telephone call?
Mrs. HELMICK. Well, it wasn't very long, I guess 15 or 20 minutes until he left.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did he tell you why he left?
Mrs. HELMICK. No. He told Rose, but he didn't tell us.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you hear him tell Rose? Did you see him talking to Rose?
Mrs. HELMICK. He said, "I will see you tomorrow." That is all I heard. He said that in sort of a loud voice, but other than that, he was talking sort of low.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How long had you talked with Ralph that evening?
Mrs. HELMICK. Well, I hadn't really talked to Ralph that evening. He just told me, well, that morning he told me where everything was, and other than that, I didn't talk to him.
Mr. GRIFFIN. But you said you had been sitting at the both talking to him.
Mrs. HELMICK. Rose and Bonnie and Toyo and this man, he is a tall man, I

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don't remember his name, but they were all teasing him, and I didn't know him know that well.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Were you sitting there or listening to the conversation?
Mrs. HELMICK. I was listening to them.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was there anything about Ralph that indicated that he was ill or wasn't feeling well?
Mrs. HELMICK. No. There was nothing said that made him sound ill.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How long did you work at the Bull Pen Drive-In after this telephone call on Saturday night?
Mrs. HELMICK. I worked until about a week after Thanksgiving.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you hear any conversation around the Bull Pen which would indicate that anybody had any advance information that Jack might do what he did?
Mrs. HELMICK. Now the next day after we had heard it on the radio, he was popping off about this telephone call that he had that night, and he told us that he talked to Jack and that they had talked about a gun, and that he had it in a dresser drawer or something like that, and that he didn't tell what he was going to do with it.
I don't even know that he told Ralph what he was going to do with it.
I don't even know that he told Ralph what he was going to do with it. [Repeating.].
Mr. GRIFFIN. When you refer to "he had it in the drawer," you mean Jack Ruby?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes. But he was telling us again what I had overheard over the telephone about the gun and about out with one or the other. And he said that he had told Jack that he was either crazy, or something like that, that he didn't know what he was doing.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Who was present during this conversation on Sunday?
Mrs. HELMICK. Everybody that worked for him was gathered around there on the other side of this object that I have drawn where the cashier stands. We were all standing around in a huddle, and John was standing on one side of the counter, and we were all on the other.
Mr. GRIFFIN. When you refer to Johnny, do you mean Ralph Paul?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Can you name the other employees who were there?
Mrs. HELMICK. It was Rose. I don't know their last names. It was Rose and Bonnie, and a boy named Joe and this tall man, and I don't remember his name, and Curly. This is an old man that works there.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Are all those people still employed there?
Mrs. HELMICK. As far as I know.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How did you happen to leave your job there?
Mrs. HELMICK. I was sick for a week, and my baby was sick for a week, and whenever I got sick, I was off for about a week and 3 days, I guess, and whenever I went back after my job, he told me I couldn't have it, that he had hired someone else.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Had you had a fight with Ralph?
Mrs. HELMICK. No, I hadn't.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Had you known Ralph Paul before then?
Mrs. HELMICK. No.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How did you happen to get your job there?
Mrs. HELMICK. He called me on the telephone.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How did he happen to get your name?
Mrs. HELMICK. I went down there after I quit another job at Pal's Drive-In in Arlington, I went down there and asked about a Job, and he called me about 3 days later.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Had he made any advances toward you?
Mrs. HELMICK. No.
Mr. GRIFFIN. You had never had anything but a business relationship with him?
Mrs. HELMICK. That is all. I must have not got too well acquainted with him. I didn't talk to him because I didn't understand him. He didn't talk like

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you. He was Jew or something and I couldn't understand him, so I just didn't talk to him.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you feel any hostility toward him?
Mrs. HELMICK. No, I felt he had it toward me. He made me feel that way.
Mr. GRIFFIN. When did you first begin to get that impression?
Mrs. HELMICK. The first day I started working for him.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What time of the day was the conversation on Sunday that you overheard?
Mrs. HELMICK. It was before Oswald died. It was about 20 minutes, I guess, after he was shot, because everybody else already knew it, and they was calling Ralph and telling him about it.
As soon as he found out about it, he called Tammi on the telephone, and Tammi came down and they left together.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was there any indication from Tammi that she had seen Jack the night before?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't remember. I can't remember if Ralph had said that "I saw Tammi the day before", or not, but he told us that, I believe he told us that he saw Jack that night.
Mr. GRIFFIN. I understand that your recollection is that oh Sunday he told you that he had seen Jack on Saturday night?
Mrs. HELMICK. I believe he did. I don't remember. It's been too long ago.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Who have you told this story to besides the FBI and people here in this room?
Mrs. HELMICK. I told it to my husband the day that it happened. He was there. As soon as I got the gossip I went and told him. That is all it was to me.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you tell anybody else that you recall?
Mrs. HELMICK. I told my whole family about the telephone call and about what happened over there, and I guess everyone knew it.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you tell any of your friends?
Mrs. HELMICK. If we got to talking about the subject, I did.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you remember any particular girl friends that you might have told it to?
Mrs. HELMICK. Girl friend?
Mr. GRIFFIN. Or boy friends?
Mrs. HELMICK. I Was talking to Joyce Bradley. I was talking to her yesterday on the telephone and told her about the letter that you all had sent me, and told her what I just told you.
Mr. GRIFFIN. But I mean shortly after this happened.
Mrs. HELMICK. Oh, well, my family, and I guess, well, I wrote to Don's relatives in Baltimore, Md., right after it happened and I told them I worked for him, and told them what was going on down here on TV and everything.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Did you tell them about this conversation that you overheard?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What is the name of that relative?
Mrs. HELMICK. Let's see, Rosemary Helmick.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where does she live?
Mrs. HELMICK. In Baltimore, Md.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you have her address?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't have it now, but at the time I wrote her, it was 4116 Dartford.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Has she moved since then?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How many times have you been interviewed by the FBI?
Mrs. HELMICK. Twice.
Mr. GRIFFIN. The second. time, did they ask you these questions that I have just been asking you about who else you told?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes, but I don't think I told them about me writing the letter, or I don't remember what I told them. I mean I have been so nervous and everything.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Why didn't you report this to the police or to the Federal authorities shortly after you heard about it?
Mrs. HELMICK. I didn't think it was anything.

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Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, you certainly must have thought it was something. You told your husband.
Mrs. HELMICK. No, I didn't tell him. I thought it was something, I just thought it was gossip, so I gossiped. They went down and talked to the police the day that Jack Ruby got arrested, so I didn't think it was anything.
I thought surely that they would tell them, so what was the use of me telling them?
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, you knew that now when you followed the Ruby trial, you knew that none of this came out in the Ruby trial?
Mrs. HELMICK. I didn't follow the Ruby trial. My TV has been broke. Well, it is not really broke but the antenna is messed up on it, and I haven't had a good TV antenna in 2 or 3 months.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How about in the newspapers, didn't you follow the newspapers?
Mrs. HELMICK. No, I don't take a newspaper. But Ralph Paul wasn't brought out in any of this.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How do you know that?
Mrs. HELMICK. I just know that he wasn't because I never heard his name mentioned by anybody else. I mean, I got the gossip. But right after the trial, I guess I don't know when the trial was, but the FBI soon found me.
Mr. GRIFFIN. They didn't find you until sometime in June, did they?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know, but these people that I worked for, they was trying to keep everything so much of a secret, and I didn't see anything wrong with what they had said. I mean, they was trying to keep Ralph Paul hid sort of.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What efforts were they making to hide it, as you say?
Mrs. HELMICK. Well, whenever the newspaper would call on the telephone, they would say that he doesn't own this place any more, or he isn't here any more. Even if he was there, they would say he wasn't there.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was that the same day that Oswald was shot, or was that later on?
Mrs. HELMICK. I believe it was that afternoon.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Is there a fellow by the name of Jackson that works there?
Mrs. HELMICK. Jackson, I believe that was that tall fellow's name that I mentioned.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Is that the fellow that Ralph Paul lived with?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know. I didn't know he lived with anyone.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was he living with Tammi?
Mrs. HELMICK. I didn't know he lived with anyone at all.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Was there anybody in that--how many waitresses did he have? Carhops and so forth?
Mrs. HELMICK. Carhops, there was me and Toyo, and 4 waitresses---this is during the daytime?
Mr. GRIFFIN. Yes.
Mrs. HELMICK. There was Bonnie and Rose.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Who did he have in the evening?
Mrs. HELMICK. I believe his name was Joe, and his wife was working nights. She had just started right after I started to work there. I don't remember if there was anybody else working there as a waitress, but there was a girl named Joe, a tall blond-headed girl, and a girl had just gotten out of the hospital and was coming back to work about three or four nights after I was working there. I can't remember her name, but we all chipped in to buy her something, some kind of gift. It was a nightgown. And she started to work there again after I did, but I don't remember her name. But I would recognize all them people if I saw them again.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Have you thought of anything else that might be helpful to us in this regard?
Mrs. HELMICK. Now I may not know anything that would help you, but surely I am not the only one that heard this. I know that I am not, and Rose and everybody that was standing around there at that counter hearing Ralph talk, they all know what I have just said. But whether they heard the conversation on the telephone that night, if they did, I don't know. They wouldn't tell me but I didn't ask any of them. But they never did say. Them people were quiet.

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They kept everything to theirselves. The reason I didn't call anybody, I was afraid to get involved, really. And I didn't know that I could be of help to anybody.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Has anybody suggested to you that you shouldn't get involved?
Mrs. HELMICK. No one ever suggested anything; because I didn't believe that it was---I mean I figured that they would find it out sooner or later, and I didn't figure that it was anything that anybody was hiding. I mean, I wasn't hiding it.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you know what significance that telephone conversation has?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know that it has any bearing on the case at all.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Why did you remember it then?
Mrs. HELMICK. Because of the gun, and after Oswald had been shot the next day, I knew that it was bound to have something to do with it.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What do you think it has to do with it?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know. My own opinion has nothing to do with this, I don't think.
Mr. GRIFFIN. You think the conversation about the gun didn't have anything to do with the shooting of Oswald? Is that what you are saying?
Mrs. HELMICK. It was the same gun that they were talking about.
Mr. GRIFFIN. How do you know that?
Mrs. HELMICK. Because Ralph told us the next day that it was.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What do you think that has to do with the shooting of Oswald?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know that he told him that he was going to shoot Oswald or not, but I do know that he told him about the gun.
Mr. GRIFFIN. You must certainly think that he might have been telling him that he was going to shoot Oswald? That is the reason he was talking about the gun?
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know what I thought. I mean, I didn't give it too much thought. I didn't give anything much thought about it then. I have thought a lot since.
Mr. GRIFFIN. What have you thought about it since?
Mrs. HELMICK. Well, in my own mind, I believe that he told Ralph Paul that he was going to shoot Oswald. But if he did, Ralph didn't tell none of us that he did. At least I don't think he did. I don't remember.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, I certainly appreciate your coming here and helping us on this.
Mrs. HELMICK. I have thought a lot on it, but I just can't remember. It's just been too long ago. If someone had suggested me calling the police or FBI or something right away, I would have. I mean I didn't have nothing to hide. I wasn't trying to hide from them, but I just never thought of it. It didn't even enter my mind, and I would have remembered a lot more then, I guess, if there was anything to remember. But it's just been too long ago.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well it's been very good of you to help us even at this point, and we are very grateful to you. I have no more questions, unless you can think of something else that you might want to add.
Mrs. HELMICK. You want to keep this?
Mr. GRIFFIN. Let me mark this.
Mrs. HELMICK. I marked it all up.
Mr. GRIFFIN. I am going to mark this diagram.
Mrs. HELMICK. You want me to tell you what all this is?
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, let me mark the diagram. I thought we had an explanation of it, but I am going to mark the diagram that you have drawn "Wanda Helmick, Deposition July 24, 1964, Exhibit No. 1."
Where are you a native of? Are you a native of Dallas?
Mrs. HELMICK. No.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Are you a native of Texas?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Whereabouts?
Mrs. HELMICK. Commerce.
Mr. GRIFFIN. I don't know where that is. Do you want to explain to us this diagram?
Mrs. HELMICK. This little line here in zigzag--

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Mr. GRIFFIN. The light wavy line that you have drawn at the bottom of the page?
Mrs. HELMICK. This is tables back in here where there is extra customers for dinner hours, and these booths are just used----
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where do people park their cars in this drive-in?
Mrs. HELMICK. I haven't got it drawn in on here, but it is back this way [indicating].
Mr. GRIFFIN. Would you mark on the other side of the wavy line the garage or parking area? Would that be proper?
Mrs. HELMICK. There is places [marking].
Mr. GRIFFIN. Where would the wall of the building be in the front?
Mrs. HELMICK. Right along in here.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Do you want to indicate that with a heavy black line. Do you want to write "wall"on it?
Mrs. HELMICK. OK; this is the wall.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Is there a walkway up?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes; there is not no walkway. There is just bars out there to stop the ears from running into the building. But there is a parking area all the way around the building for carhops. I have wrote "car parking" where the carhops just service the cars. But there is a place for them to park all the way around the building. There is mirrors outside in front for the carhops to see from the booths.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Would you want to mark that this is a booth where you put your X? (Mrs. Helmick marks.)
Mr. GRIFFIN. Would you want to mark in the area where the tables are? Write the word "tables" where it was you said the tables were.
Mrs. HELMICK. Oh, these?
Mr. GRIFFIN. Yes. (Mrs. Helmick writes.)
Mr. GRIFFIN. Now, if that is a reasonably accurate diagram of what we were talking about, I will ask you to sign it. If you think there is anything more to put on it, go ahead and do it.
Mrs. HELMICK. I don't know.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Why don't you sign it with the pen I gave you there?
Mrs. HELMICK (signing). It is not a very good diagram.
Mr. GRIFFIN. But you think it is accurate enough for the purpose of what you have explained to us?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. I will ask you one more question. How many telephones were at the Bull Pen Drive-in?
Mrs. HELMICK. Just the one pay telephone.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Are you sure that it is a pay telephone?
Mrs. HELMICK. Yes.
Mr. GRIFFIN. Well, thank you very much.